Stuart: The other day, I was sitting in a parking lot, and it was pretty full, with everyone trying to find a park. As I was watching, this vehicle drove into a parking spot fast, and literally as it came to a halt, a second vehicle stopped right behind it. In the second vehicle was a woman who was all but apoplectic with anger, and who proceeded to berate the man who had been driving the first vehicle.
Ethan: Sounds exciting.
Kurt: Voyeuristic, if you ask me.
Stuart: Well, what intrigued me about it, was that I was sitting in my car, listening to music, so I could actually hear anything. The effect was further exaggerated as I was actually watching this scene play out through my rear-view mirror. It was so surreal, these people waving their arms at each other, with angry faces and clearly letting their emotions run high. I felt like I had been transported into some sort of a computer game- almost like being in the Sims, where your character has an angry face, and he grumbles as he walks around your house. You are not entirely sure why he is angry, and so you sit there trying to work out the other half of the story.
Lester: Kind of like Dungeon Keeper then, with your demons walking around with a black cloud over their heads, and threatening to leave your danger.
Stuart: Well, almost exactly like that. This incident was very brief, so it was equally as strange when all of sudden the woman got back into her car and drove off with some aggression. It was the literal flash-temper, and almost like a slightly plastic exchange, it was over. 'Your character is now satisfied, and you may now move onto the next problem...'
Claire: Ok, I seriously think you need to get out more.
Ethan: No, I hear exactly what you are saying. It has been a problem that I have grappled with for some time. I think the most profound expose on this, for me, was in Pan's Labyrinth. To a lesser extent, there is a discussion of the same themes in Hellboy 2...
Kurt: Oh, so now we're discussing high art, are we?
Ethan: (ignoring Kurt)...in that there is this growing tension between fantasy and reality. I have this growing fear that our extreme emphasis on the real is doing immeasurable harm to our psyche as human beings. Consider the basic escapism of fantasy books that we used to read as children, or the cartoons we used to watch. They were innocent, naive, and just earnestly charming. There was no innuendo, so alter agenda, in fact no attempt to be anything other than aimed at children. Now we have Spongebob Squarepants with his thinly veiled references to drugs, and psychedelic world.
Kurt: Well, I disagree. I think Spongebob is as wholesome as your idealised shows.
Stuart: You cannot mean that.
Lester: I don't know, when I was a child, all I wanted was to be grown up.
Claire: We know.
Ethan: Do you think it is just sepia-tinged nostalgia? I am just imagining this, or is this a legitimate gripe? Are children being expected to adopt a sophistication and worldliness that is just unrealistic, and dangerous? I know that every generation insists that the next is collapsing, but I do wonder if perhaps we are being exposed to too much these days before we are actually prepared to handle it.
Charles: I think we tend to create a phantamasgoria in our heads. We have surrounded ourselves with so many distractions, that we tend to forget what is real. This is, equally, a very popular observation- people like to point out a discongruence in life, and the general confusion that goes with it. So there is once again a system of push and pull, and if the parents are uncertain, then what does that mean for the children? A failing moral system, interlinked with a plethora of knowledge and availability, that people seem to be increasingly ill-equipped to contend with.
Claire: That is an extraordinarily cynical observation for you.
Ethan: I don't know, I think Charles is right. I think there is an element of unreality in everything we do in our worlds today. We are all expected to have perfect bodies, perfect hair, and all just generally be beautiful. We demand a life partner, someone who one can love, and love in such an extreme way, as well as expecting the extraordinary in the experiences and emotions that we encounter in our daily lives.
Kurt: "Our life is not a movie, or maybe..."
Ethan: Precisely. We have become so accustomed to seeing these extreme romances on television, people being put into impossible situations, and coming out the hero. I sometimes feel like I have become sealed off from the world, forced to insulate myself between the element of longing that media preys upon, and the often harsh reality of the world itself.
Kurt: Expected to be increasingly realistic, with the result that we are becoming increasingly escapist.
Claire: (softly) And ill-equipped to cope with the rigours of people and life...
Stuart: I was walking in the centre of town the other day, and I encountered this triumvirate of women, parading down the street, each pushing a pram with a child in it. Yet, these women all look so ravaged, and hard. Life had been cruel to them, as shown by their lined faces and nicotine stained teeth. These were not the "glowing woman, proudly showing off her child, whilst cars slow to watch her walk..."
Claire: I think you may all actually be lemmings here. Is it not possible that you are all just buying into this idea? I think you are all over-thinking this, observing a result, and then drawing your theory from the conclusion. You all know, perfectly well, that that is a very poor exercise in thought. Think of yourselves, all highly-educated, drawing thoughts from your own discomfort, feeling of being out of place, and, dare I say, despair. Can you understand someone who is perhaps not as intellectually defined as yourself? Somehow, I doubt it.
Ethan: So a nostalgia for a utopia we have never known...?
Claire: Exactly. It is easier to imagine than to deal with the world around you.
Ethan: Perhaps. It is a thought that I have not discounted. My own personal difficulties, and sense of desperation are just not translatable to some sort of a general indictment on the world around me.
Stuart: Well, I still think it is weird when I encounter a child, not even one year old, being carried around with a full hair weave. She had almost had more hair than there was a body, and with pierced ears as well. It truly was a little copy of the mother, her own personal Barbie doll.
Ethan: Leaving us to walk on, and wonder...
Sunday, December 13, 2009
An obstruse conversation
Ethan: "Have any of you seen that new billboard that they have put outside the entrance to town? It is for that advertising company with the slogan "We think outside of the box"?"
Kurt: "Yeah, I get a chuckle out of it every morning."
Ethan: "It drives me crazy. It has this picture of four young women, showing from just below their breasts to the upper part of their thighs. Essentially a belly button shot. All four are white, in a row, wearing black underwear, and one has a belly stud. I mean, how is this even remotely inventive? It is not particularly revealing, by the standards of today, and it is hardly as if there is anything particularly risqué about it."
Stuart: "It seems to me that they are so far inside the box that they can't even see the box..."
Ethan: "I always half wonder whether they are referring to the one with the stud as being 'out of the box'. Can't imagine why though, perhaps we should be asking what their faces look like, or something."
Claire: "Anyone want to fill me in on what the 'box' is, exactly?"
Lester: "Well, I guess it would constitute the commonplace..."
Kurt: "Perhaps you might want to stop verbalizing your thoughts, genius."
Claire: "Anyone for more coffee? I need a break from you lot."
Ethan: "It is an interesting thought, if they think this particular advert is in some way inventive, it logically demands their conception of normal. I mean, to me, this advert is so unbelievably cliché in modern advertising as to render it obsolete."
Stuart: "Am I missing something? Do you think it is meant to be ironic?"
Ethan: "Maybe it is a demand to us, as the viewer, to use our imagination on the advert."
Lester: *snicker* "Maybe we need to imagine what is inside the box..."
Kurt: "I am glad we could finally introduce some filth."
Ethan: "We keep telling you to remove your mind from the gutter, but then I suppose that would be asking too much."
Lester: "Porn and cigarettes account for much of my childhood. What can I say? Certain things are still essential."
Kurt: "Please tell me that your childhood at least began at puberty..."
Ethan: "And that ratty army backpack that was buried under the Wendy-house that you would visit every other day. Like you thought we didn't know about that. Did it never cross your mind that your coming in and out of the house all the time with that thing wasn't going to raise suspicion?"
Lester: "Well, I did always toy with the idea of staying outside."
Stuart: "Ah, hell. I just caught that box comment. I think this needs to stop right now."
Lester: "What, is this a little too much for your puritanical sensibilities?"
Stuart: "Personally, I do not feel in the slight bit inclined to lower myself to your debased and regressive patterns of thinking."
Kurt: "Oh, right, that whole my mind is a temple, completely removed from the destructive forces of outside forces. If I were the government, you would be the kind of person I would put on my "Watch List" as most likely to be inclined to extremist activities."
Kurt: "Yeah, I get a chuckle out of it every morning."
Ethan: "It drives me crazy. It has this picture of four young women, showing from just below their breasts to the upper part of their thighs. Essentially a belly button shot. All four are white, in a row, wearing black underwear, and one has a belly stud. I mean, how is this even remotely inventive? It is not particularly revealing, by the standards of today, and it is hardly as if there is anything particularly risqué about it."
Stuart: "It seems to me that they are so far inside the box that they can't even see the box..."
Ethan: "I always half wonder whether they are referring to the one with the stud as being 'out of the box'. Can't imagine why though, perhaps we should be asking what their faces look like, or something."
Claire: "Anyone want to fill me in on what the 'box' is, exactly?"
Lester: "Well, I guess it would constitute the commonplace..."
Kurt: "Perhaps you might want to stop verbalizing your thoughts, genius."
Claire: "Anyone for more coffee? I need a break from you lot."
Ethan: "It is an interesting thought, if they think this particular advert is in some way inventive, it logically demands their conception of normal. I mean, to me, this advert is so unbelievably cliché in modern advertising as to render it obsolete."
Stuart: "Am I missing something? Do you think it is meant to be ironic?"
Ethan: "Maybe it is a demand to us, as the viewer, to use our imagination on the advert."
Lester: *snicker* "Maybe we need to imagine what is inside the box..."
Kurt: "I am glad we could finally introduce some filth."
Ethan: "We keep telling you to remove your mind from the gutter, but then I suppose that would be asking too much."
Lester: "Porn and cigarettes account for much of my childhood. What can I say? Certain things are still essential."
Kurt: "Please tell me that your childhood at least began at puberty..."
Ethan: "And that ratty army backpack that was buried under the Wendy-house that you would visit every other day. Like you thought we didn't know about that. Did it never cross your mind that your coming in and out of the house all the time with that thing wasn't going to raise suspicion?"
Lester: "Well, I did always toy with the idea of staying outside."
Stuart: "Ah, hell. I just caught that box comment. I think this needs to stop right now."
Lester: "What, is this a little too much for your puritanical sensibilities?"
Stuart: "Personally, I do not feel in the slight bit inclined to lower myself to your debased and regressive patterns of thinking."
Kurt: "Oh, right, that whole my mind is a temple, completely removed from the destructive forces of outside forces. If I were the government, you would be the kind of person I would put on my "Watch List" as most likely to be inclined to extremist activities."
Sunday, November 8, 2009
Number 2.
Claire: "Can we go back to discussing romance?"
Kurt: "Oh, because we all have some meaningful titbit to add, do we?"
Ethan: “Is there not possibly something to be drawn from all this? For all the time that we may have spent on “bettering ourselves” (as it were), we should never forget to actually live our own lives. Of course, the problem comes in at the level at how one is able to communicate with other people when information is too esoteric for most people. At any given point, people will not have read the same authors or listened to the same music, and as a result neither can be a meaningful source of conversation. The paradox to this is that I think we need to get away from the analogous old fashioned idea that the best and the brightest of people were all classics scholars. They would read the Roman and Greek Masters, and be able to quote them verbatim at any opportune moment. I think that the idea of intelligence has been adapted to such an extent that now we need to be able to recognise intelligence as operating on a number of spheres.”
Lester: “You still can’t get away from the fact that if you are going to dismiss music and literature as fairly futile sources of connection, then at best all that remains is to discuss the banal. We need to watch Jerry Springer and E-News as a safe source of conversation.”
Claire: “Wow, now that is low.”
Ethan: “And how do we then answer our earlier criticism that everyone is just not as capable, intellectually, as each other, but at the same time, argue that we need to recognise that intelligence can exist on a number of spheres? How do we make that criticism, but at the same time acknowledge that all people are different and that perhaps there needs to be a re-thinking of the traditional notion of intelligence that translates only as high test scores?”
Kurt: "You know, I really am rather tired of you harping on about this. Just because you feel that your social inadequacies are insurmountable, it doesn't mean we want to keep discussing them. These diatribes about how no-one listens to obscure music, or reads old books is getting very dull."
Ethan: "Well, I am just trying to say that the world has gotten too large for us, in that there is just too much information such we end up constantly looking for common ground as opposed to actually discussing what we are really interested in."
Kurt: "Oh God, not another Coupland quote. He is so passé, and besides which, anyone who has ever read more than two of his books knows that his stories are so rote now. What was once 'edgy' is now just boring."
[silence]
Kurt: "What, too harsh?"
Stuart: "I recall reading this article about French women in the office and there was this great line that people need to realise that their lives are not nearly as interesting as they would like to believe. The mantra is that one should never discuss one's children, or anything personal, as people really just don't care. It is tedious. I have to say, I tend to agree, although I can't say that the advice to discuss politics, art or literature would really work in my office."
Claire: "Yeah, and you have to admit, there are few better non-starters than to hear someone gushing about how happy they are. I want to reach for the nearest bottle when I hear someone talking about their beautiful, talented children, when back at the Ranch they are probably sugar-hyped little monsters."
Lester: "So, no children on the horizon any time soon then?"
Claire: "No, just drinking too much."
Stuart: "We are a very miserable group of people, I trust that you all realise that."
Ethan: "I like to think of it as enlightened, thank you very much"
Kurt: "Hardened by the wiles of the world."
Ethan: "I just think its funny, as if you think about almost all the popular TV series currently on, they all play this game of unrequited love and loss. He gets the girl, he loses the girl. She finds her man, he turns out to be an asshole, and then redeems himself. I don't mean to stereotype either gender, of course, but you know what I mean. There is this constant push-pull tension, which is all very farcical actually. I have always wondered what they are trying to tap into with that, although they are obviously appealing to something."
Lester: [falsetto] "Maybe one day, it will happen to me..."
Stuart: "I think I have lost count on how many shows I have lost interest in as a result of that dynamic. I always just want the girl to get the guy, or vice versa, and be done with it. This, now they're together...now they're not...oh, wait...they are again- it just irritates me."
Ethan: "A magician pulling a rabbit from the hat, and the showing you exactly how it is done. Sort of ruins it. And then combine that with a comedian pounding a joke into the floor, repeating the same thing over and over again. The joke inevitably has to lose its appeal. Kind of like adverts, actually."
Lester: "Oh, and as for that bro-mance nonsense. The moment I heard that phrase, I promised myself that I would never watch anything that is tagged in association with it. Gee, guys, did anyone ever think that men have friends? Let's call it something and exploit it for all its worth."
Kurt: "Speaking of which. did any of you see that news report on the growth of the so-called Ojo-man or "girly-men" in Japan? Its hilarious, they also refer to them as herbivorous males."
Claire: "What?"
Kurt: "They are attributing it to economic decline, but apparently there is this increasing growth of mostly heterosexual men in Japan who spend their time shopping at small boutiques and eating cake. Yes, you heard me correctly, apparently it is a big deal to eat cake."
Ethan: "Marie Antoinette would be so proud"
Kurt: "What really intrigued me about it, though was that, apart from interesting habits, which I will get to, these guys are mostly just profoundly normal. They keep low-key, humble jobs, look to women more as friends, and generally eschew those traditionally masculine past-times such as designer labels and fast cars."
Lester: "Alright, and the interesting habits?"
Kurt: "Well, it appears that in Japan they have begun marketing weaker beers, there is a company that sells bras for men (though Lord knows that purpose they serve) and there is a fashion designer who is about to release a collection of skirts and lacy tops for men."
Lester: "Sounds precious."
Stuart: "I love the fact that it is being attributed to the Depression- the argument being that people can't afford expensive cars, beautiful girlfriends or designer goods, so this is the evolution."
Claire: "I have to note 'can't afford beautiful girlfriends...' "
Kurt: "Well it is true, even if I am sticking my head up over the parapet by saying it. But to get back to my point, no mention is made of whether perhaps there is a more profound shift in male attitudes in the new century than just simply as a reaction to fiscal problems."
Ethan: "Well, I once told a girlfriend that men, as previously existed, are a dying species. In my opinion, it is a reality that any educated man is not permitted to be a boorish chauvinist if he wishes to have any sort of life outside of bachelor-dom. Men are expected to take proper care of themselves, dress well, cook, and show far more empathy and emotion than ever before. In fact, the development of the feminist movement necessarily had to erode the notion of the "traditional" male to such an extent that is now expected that men be in "touch with their feminine sides". I am not saying this is necessarily a bad thing, but I do think that it is creating a slight crisis in men, if not for both genders. It almost as if we are trying to create a neuter-sex as the norm for society."
Claire: "What did your girlfriend say to that?"
Ethan: "Not much, we broke up shortly afterwards."
Claire: "Serves you right for suggesting that men shouldn't at least know how to cook."
Stuart: "But what do you mean by a neuter-sex? Is that not a little extreme?"
Ethan: "Well, possibly, but what I am saying is that society seems to be heading in the direction where women are expected to be tougher, and more aggressive in their business transactions, whilst men are expected to be gentler and be, dare I say it, more sophisticated in their interactions with people. In other words, we have a situation where people, depending on their gender, are expected to adopt traits of the other in order to attain success."
Claire: "I don't think you're correct there at all. Let's face it, the problems women face in the work place are just as bad as they have ever been. Most men still behave as they own the place, and just treat women as second class citizens, as objects more often than not."
Kurt: "But I think you forget that there are more women in positions of power than ever before. I don't say there is equality, in position or income, between men and women, to the contrary, but we do have a situation where some major businesses are run by women. That would certainly have never been allowed before."
Ethan: "I have always thought that in the working world, most jobs are generally better suited to women than men. Let's face it, women are generally far harder working, and much more conscientious about things. A guy will just get it done, and clean up the mess afterwards. I think it is worth noting that men are now expected to try and match these traits, just to survive in most professional jobs, and especially at the lower entry levels of employment."
Kurt: "There is just that pesky reproduction thing."
Lester: "All hail the conquering hero- men are safe...If they are better than you, just get them pregnant and make sure you get their job."
Ethan: [laughter] "I think your chauvinism just showed us that the alpha-male tendencies are alive and well. Sorry folks, false alarm. This whole discussion is completely incorrect, there is no crisis."
Claire: "Yeah, you're not allowed to speak any more. And I think you may find your bed very cold later."
Ethan: "Joking aside, I do think that the manifestations of the "modern male" and expectations of them are beginning to become firmly ensconced in the public eye. Take, for example, the new mania on male grooming. There is an unprecedented growth in male cosmetics, which although people are talking about them, haven't really made it into the mainstream public yet, as far as I know. My personal favourite has to be "guy-liner"- that has to be marketing licence if ever I have heard it."
Kurt: "The companies must think it is hilarious. Take eye-liner, rename it and pretend its something new. 'Specially designed for men, get yours today' "
Ethan: "But I would say that as a general rule, most of these products have been accepted, even if many guys are just too embarrassed to talk about it. Think about how common it is now for guys to moisturize, or to dye and gel their hair. Gone are the days of the caveman, letting his natural odour speak for him."
Stuart: "I cannot believe we are actually talking about this."
Kurt: "There is a flaw in your argument though. It is not as if girls have given up on the chauvinist male. In fact, they are alive and well, and generally have better romantic lives than your "sensitive nice guy". In fact, all of your perennially single males fall precisely into the latter category, whilst, generally, the jocks, have girls chasing them furiously."
[silence]
Claire: "I think you just hit a nerve."
Kurt: "Did I?"
Claire: "Yeah, I think that argument has been a great source of consolation over the years."
Kurt: "Oh. Sorry. Well, those girls can reap the benefits of their choices in the future."
Kurt: "Oh, because we all have some meaningful titbit to add, do we?"
Ethan: “Is there not possibly something to be drawn from all this? For all the time that we may have spent on “bettering ourselves” (as it were), we should never forget to actually live our own lives. Of course, the problem comes in at the level at how one is able to communicate with other people when information is too esoteric for most people. At any given point, people will not have read the same authors or listened to the same music, and as a result neither can be a meaningful source of conversation. The paradox to this is that I think we need to get away from the analogous old fashioned idea that the best and the brightest of people were all classics scholars. They would read the Roman and Greek Masters, and be able to quote them verbatim at any opportune moment. I think that the idea of intelligence has been adapted to such an extent that now we need to be able to recognise intelligence as operating on a number of spheres.”
Lester: “You still can’t get away from the fact that if you are going to dismiss music and literature as fairly futile sources of connection, then at best all that remains is to discuss the banal. We need to watch Jerry Springer and E-News as a safe source of conversation.”
Claire: “Wow, now that is low.”
Ethan: “And how do we then answer our earlier criticism that everyone is just not as capable, intellectually, as each other, but at the same time, argue that we need to recognise that intelligence can exist on a number of spheres? How do we make that criticism, but at the same time acknowledge that all people are different and that perhaps there needs to be a re-thinking of the traditional notion of intelligence that translates only as high test scores?”
Kurt: "You know, I really am rather tired of you harping on about this. Just because you feel that your social inadequacies are insurmountable, it doesn't mean we want to keep discussing them. These diatribes about how no-one listens to obscure music, or reads old books is getting very dull."
Ethan: "Well, I am just trying to say that the world has gotten too large for us, in that there is just too much information such we end up constantly looking for common ground as opposed to actually discussing what we are really interested in."
Kurt: "Oh God, not another Coupland quote. He is so passé, and besides which, anyone who has ever read more than two of his books knows that his stories are so rote now. What was once 'edgy' is now just boring."
[silence]
Kurt: "What, too harsh?"
Stuart: "I recall reading this article about French women in the office and there was this great line that people need to realise that their lives are not nearly as interesting as they would like to believe. The mantra is that one should never discuss one's children, or anything personal, as people really just don't care. It is tedious. I have to say, I tend to agree, although I can't say that the advice to discuss politics, art or literature would really work in my office."
Claire: "Yeah, and you have to admit, there are few better non-starters than to hear someone gushing about how happy they are. I want to reach for the nearest bottle when I hear someone talking about their beautiful, talented children, when back at the Ranch they are probably sugar-hyped little monsters."
Lester: "So, no children on the horizon any time soon then?"
Claire: "No, just drinking too much."
Stuart: "We are a very miserable group of people, I trust that you all realise that."
Ethan: "I like to think of it as enlightened, thank you very much"
Kurt: "Hardened by the wiles of the world."
Ethan: "I just think its funny, as if you think about almost all the popular TV series currently on, they all play this game of unrequited love and loss. He gets the girl, he loses the girl. She finds her man, he turns out to be an asshole, and then redeems himself. I don't mean to stereotype either gender, of course, but you know what I mean. There is this constant push-pull tension, which is all very farcical actually. I have always wondered what they are trying to tap into with that, although they are obviously appealing to something."
Lester: [falsetto] "Maybe one day, it will happen to me..."
Stuart: "I think I have lost count on how many shows I have lost interest in as a result of that dynamic. I always just want the girl to get the guy, or vice versa, and be done with it. This, now they're together...now they're not...oh, wait...they are again- it just irritates me."
Ethan: "A magician pulling a rabbit from the hat, and the showing you exactly how it is done. Sort of ruins it. And then combine that with a comedian pounding a joke into the floor, repeating the same thing over and over again. The joke inevitably has to lose its appeal. Kind of like adverts, actually."
Lester: "Oh, and as for that bro-mance nonsense. The moment I heard that phrase, I promised myself that I would never watch anything that is tagged in association with it. Gee, guys, did anyone ever think that men have friends? Let's call it something and exploit it for all its worth."
Kurt: "Speaking of which. did any of you see that news report on the growth of the so-called Ojo-man or "girly-men" in Japan? Its hilarious, they also refer to them as herbivorous males."
Claire: "What?"
Kurt: "They are attributing it to economic decline, but apparently there is this increasing growth of mostly heterosexual men in Japan who spend their time shopping at small boutiques and eating cake. Yes, you heard me correctly, apparently it is a big deal to eat cake."
Ethan: "Marie Antoinette would be so proud"
Kurt: "What really intrigued me about it, though was that, apart from interesting habits, which I will get to, these guys are mostly just profoundly normal. They keep low-key, humble jobs, look to women more as friends, and generally eschew those traditionally masculine past-times such as designer labels and fast cars."
Lester: "Alright, and the interesting habits?"
Kurt: "Well, it appears that in Japan they have begun marketing weaker beers, there is a company that sells bras for men (though Lord knows that purpose they serve) and there is a fashion designer who is about to release a collection of skirts and lacy tops for men."
Lester: "Sounds precious."
Stuart: "I love the fact that it is being attributed to the Depression- the argument being that people can't afford expensive cars, beautiful girlfriends or designer goods, so this is the evolution."
Claire: "I have to note 'can't afford beautiful girlfriends...' "
Kurt: "Well it is true, even if I am sticking my head up over the parapet by saying it. But to get back to my point, no mention is made of whether perhaps there is a more profound shift in male attitudes in the new century than just simply as a reaction to fiscal problems."
Ethan: "Well, I once told a girlfriend that men, as previously existed, are a dying species. In my opinion, it is a reality that any educated man is not permitted to be a boorish chauvinist if he wishes to have any sort of life outside of bachelor-dom. Men are expected to take proper care of themselves, dress well, cook, and show far more empathy and emotion than ever before. In fact, the development of the feminist movement necessarily had to erode the notion of the "traditional" male to such an extent that is now expected that men be in "touch with their feminine sides". I am not saying this is necessarily a bad thing, but I do think that it is creating a slight crisis in men, if not for both genders. It almost as if we are trying to create a neuter-sex as the norm for society."
Claire: "What did your girlfriend say to that?"
Ethan: "Not much, we broke up shortly afterwards."
Claire: "Serves you right for suggesting that men shouldn't at least know how to cook."
Stuart: "But what do you mean by a neuter-sex? Is that not a little extreme?"
Ethan: "Well, possibly, but what I am saying is that society seems to be heading in the direction where women are expected to be tougher, and more aggressive in their business transactions, whilst men are expected to be gentler and be, dare I say it, more sophisticated in their interactions with people. In other words, we have a situation where people, depending on their gender, are expected to adopt traits of the other in order to attain success."
Claire: "I don't think you're correct there at all. Let's face it, the problems women face in the work place are just as bad as they have ever been. Most men still behave as they own the place, and just treat women as second class citizens, as objects more often than not."
Kurt: "But I think you forget that there are more women in positions of power than ever before. I don't say there is equality, in position or income, between men and women, to the contrary, but we do have a situation where some major businesses are run by women. That would certainly have never been allowed before."
Ethan: "I have always thought that in the working world, most jobs are generally better suited to women than men. Let's face it, women are generally far harder working, and much more conscientious about things. A guy will just get it done, and clean up the mess afterwards. I think it is worth noting that men are now expected to try and match these traits, just to survive in most professional jobs, and especially at the lower entry levels of employment."
Kurt: "There is just that pesky reproduction thing."
Lester: "All hail the conquering hero- men are safe...If they are better than you, just get them pregnant and make sure you get their job."
Ethan: [laughter] "I think your chauvinism just showed us that the alpha-male tendencies are alive and well. Sorry folks, false alarm. This whole discussion is completely incorrect, there is no crisis."
Claire: "Yeah, you're not allowed to speak any more. And I think you may find your bed very cold later."
Ethan: "Joking aside, I do think that the manifestations of the "modern male" and expectations of them are beginning to become firmly ensconced in the public eye. Take, for example, the new mania on male grooming. There is an unprecedented growth in male cosmetics, which although people are talking about them, haven't really made it into the mainstream public yet, as far as I know. My personal favourite has to be "guy-liner"- that has to be marketing licence if ever I have heard it."
Kurt: "The companies must think it is hilarious. Take eye-liner, rename it and pretend its something new. 'Specially designed for men, get yours today' "
Ethan: "But I would say that as a general rule, most of these products have been accepted, even if many guys are just too embarrassed to talk about it. Think about how common it is now for guys to moisturize, or to dye and gel their hair. Gone are the days of the caveman, letting his natural odour speak for him."
Stuart: "I cannot believe we are actually talking about this."
Kurt: "There is a flaw in your argument though. It is not as if girls have given up on the chauvinist male. In fact, they are alive and well, and generally have better romantic lives than your "sensitive nice guy". In fact, all of your perennially single males fall precisely into the latter category, whilst, generally, the jocks, have girls chasing them furiously."
[silence]
Claire: "I think you just hit a nerve."
Kurt: "Did I?"
Claire: "Yeah, I think that argument has been a great source of consolation over the years."
Kurt: "Oh. Sorry. Well, those girls can reap the benefits of their choices in the future."
Saturday, November 7, 2009
A First Round of Conversation
Claire: "Rather hard to follow, isn't he?"
Kurt: "Well, there is certainly an off-the-cuff momentum to all of it. He is adopting the tone of the commentator, but at once only reacting to stimuli. There is no particular theme adopted, and as a result there are some rather dubious logical leaps."
Claire: "I think it is very earnest.”
Kurt: "You would"
Ethan: "What concerns me is that there is an undercurrent of angst evident. It is almost like a teenager scribbling furiously into a diary, proclaiming the unfairness of the world because parents are unforgiving. And, worst of all, it is just discourse disguised as educated opinion. He has produced the very thing to which he seems so opposed- an opinion which is little more than that. He is no expert in anything he proclaims to be. It is simply a series of questions, with little or no input being offered. There is an extended rumination about high ideals, and yet in the opening words, he cannot but concede that he is inescapably a member of this world. Discussing Aeschylus and Bellville? Indeed."
Lester: "Sorry, I wasn't listening. What are you lot on about?"
Kurt: "Why do you even come to these things, you prick?"
Stuart: "I would greatly appreciate it if you would refrain from such uncouth language."
Kurt: "You? Again? Well, I am sure you would greatly appreciate it..."
Claire: "I like the idea of advertising exploiting retro-packaging to sell their product in hard times. I had never thought of it, although it certainly does make sense."
Ethan: “Have you never heard of that before? I don’t know where I picked it up, although I would be interested to hear whether the marketing courses make mention of the ploy. It does make sense though, doesn’t it? It is really just an extension of the ‘think good things, and good things will happen to you’. Maybe I am just incurably suspicious of any sort of self-help that is cleverly guaranteed to change our lives. Then again, I always half thought that it was fairly self-evident that having a positive attitude generally makes things easier. Anyone who plays any sport will know that if you convince yourself you are going to lose before you start, you’re probably not in the best place prior to the commencement of the match.”
Claire: "But I don't understand why I should apologise for enjoying romantic comedies? We can't all be disciples of Jean-Luc Godard and Gus van Sant, and in any event, to be relentlessly intellectual is far too exhausting for most people. Not everyone is excited by a brain that can never be turned off."
Kurt: "I don't think you've understood the point though. I think what he is trying to do is ask the question that although some may get immense enjoyment out of simple romantic comedies, do we not still owe it to ourselves to try and watch, every now and then, something a little more difficult? Something that is going to challenge, as opposed to being predicable?"
Lester: "But not everyone is determined to muse over the "hard" questions. Some of us just want to sit back and relax."
Ethan: "The question is then whether that just constitutes laziness, and, as a consequence, a general depreciation in our society."
Kurt: "Ah yes, but we are not all great leaders, or scientists, or authors or whatever. Most of us are nothing better than average, and are content not to offer any lasting legacy to history. Beyond our teeming offspring, of course..."
Ethan: "I do believe that you have just revealed the exact complaint that is being raised. The fact of the matter is that we, as a people, are as decidedly average as we have ever been, and in fact there has been far less development in our race over the past thousand years than we would like to pretend. I don’t doubt that that argument is perhaps not sustainable if faced by particular instances, and yet, somehow, I cannot help but fear that the human condition remains as debased and simple as ever.”
Kurt: "I suppose one has to take into account the "Reach for the Stars" type attitude popularised by the American Dream. Let's face it, this is a world wide phenomenon now, where everyone is ingrained with the idea that one can do anything if it is desired enough. This is nonsense, of course, but people need to find that out for themselves."
Stuart: "And let us just leave aside any comment on the quality of those shows, as being completely irrelevant for what we are discussing here."
Lester: "But, by the same token, I feel that I need to watch Jerry Springer, as I need to keep in touch with what is going on, see what I am up against. And besides, its fun watching rednecks screw up their lives."
Kurt: "Cynical, non? I do believe we have an elitist lurking in our midst."
Claire: "But even if the American Dream is wishful, is it a bad thing for people to have aspirations? I cannot help but think that there should be an element of self-improvement evident in all people, however I do not agree that the only means of that improvement lies in intellectual pursuits."
Ethan: "What is the alternative then? Isn't it just narcissism to spend all one's time exercising, just to make sure one looks good? And although selflessness is perhaps a noble pursuit, and something to aspire to, I don't know that it is realistic, given our capitalist climate. In addition to which, I just don't believe that all people are capable of such a giving nature. Call me a cynic, I guess."
Charles: “Moral development doesn’t necessarily require intellectual sophistication.”
Kurt: “He speaks!”
Ethan: “Religion is simply the opiate of the masses.”
Kurt: “But you are just an arse"
Stuart: “But do we really want to go down the road of religion? We could really be getting into a debate on the value of religion, and the increasing secularisation of the modern world. The churches are in crisis, as they fail to appeal to a number of the youth of today, as well as answer many of the more liberal ideals that are becoming regarded as common place in society. Does this mean that as our moral code fails, there is an increasing threat of anarchy? Or is this simply an over-reaction to the problems of religion, as it is only those people who regard themselves as “educated” that show increasing disillusion with the Church, and in fact, amongst the masses, faith is as strong as ever?”
Claire: “Did any of you read that article on the NY Times about some of the places people are opting to go to on ‘date nights’? Little out of the way takeaways, the idea being to emphasise the informal, keep it cheap, but also be able to do something a little different.”
Ethan: “Now there is a non-sequiter if ever I have heard one…”
Kurt: “No, I didn’t see that. But then I can’t say that I browse the news for things like that…”
Claire: “Liar. By the way, I think E-News is on right now”
Lester: “I know, and did you see what she was wearing whilst she was walking her dog? I mean, honestly, darling if you have to pick up your dog’s crap, at least be stylish whilst you do it!”
Claire: “Har har”
Ethan: “Now, now, children. For all the soreness of the topic, I think there are many more closet romantics than most will ever admit. But, even I have to say that there was a line in the article where the interviewee “sighs” and says something about her being “too in love for own good”. I wanted to throw up.”
Stuart: “Does this mean that religion is no longer a question that people are interested in discussing?”
[silence]
Stuart: “Hmphff, I have my answer then.”
Kurt: "Well, there is certainly an off-the-cuff momentum to all of it. He is adopting the tone of the commentator, but at once only reacting to stimuli. There is no particular theme adopted, and as a result there are some rather dubious logical leaps."
Claire: "I think it is very earnest.”
Kurt: "You would"
Ethan: "What concerns me is that there is an undercurrent of angst evident. It is almost like a teenager scribbling furiously into a diary, proclaiming the unfairness of the world because parents are unforgiving. And, worst of all, it is just discourse disguised as educated opinion. He has produced the very thing to which he seems so opposed- an opinion which is little more than that. He is no expert in anything he proclaims to be. It is simply a series of questions, with little or no input being offered. There is an extended rumination about high ideals, and yet in the opening words, he cannot but concede that he is inescapably a member of this world. Discussing Aeschylus and Bellville? Indeed."
Lester: "Sorry, I wasn't listening. What are you lot on about?"
Kurt: "Why do you even come to these things, you prick?"
Stuart: "I would greatly appreciate it if you would refrain from such uncouth language."
Kurt: "You? Again? Well, I am sure you would greatly appreciate it..."
Claire: "I like the idea of advertising exploiting retro-packaging to sell their product in hard times. I had never thought of it, although it certainly does make sense."
Ethan: “Have you never heard of that before? I don’t know where I picked it up, although I would be interested to hear whether the marketing courses make mention of the ploy. It does make sense though, doesn’t it? It is really just an extension of the ‘think good things, and good things will happen to you’. Maybe I am just incurably suspicious of any sort of self-help that is cleverly guaranteed to change our lives. Then again, I always half thought that it was fairly self-evident that having a positive attitude generally makes things easier. Anyone who plays any sport will know that if you convince yourself you are going to lose before you start, you’re probably not in the best place prior to the commencement of the match.”
Claire: "But I don't understand why I should apologise for enjoying romantic comedies? We can't all be disciples of Jean-Luc Godard and Gus van Sant, and in any event, to be relentlessly intellectual is far too exhausting for most people. Not everyone is excited by a brain that can never be turned off."
Kurt: "I don't think you've understood the point though. I think what he is trying to do is ask the question that although some may get immense enjoyment out of simple romantic comedies, do we not still owe it to ourselves to try and watch, every now and then, something a little more difficult? Something that is going to challenge, as opposed to being predicable?"
Lester: "But not everyone is determined to muse over the "hard" questions. Some of us just want to sit back and relax."
Ethan: "The question is then whether that just constitutes laziness, and, as a consequence, a general depreciation in our society."
Kurt: "Ah yes, but we are not all great leaders, or scientists, or authors or whatever. Most of us are nothing better than average, and are content not to offer any lasting legacy to history. Beyond our teeming offspring, of course..."
Ethan: "I do believe that you have just revealed the exact complaint that is being raised. The fact of the matter is that we, as a people, are as decidedly average as we have ever been, and in fact there has been far less development in our race over the past thousand years than we would like to pretend. I don’t doubt that that argument is perhaps not sustainable if faced by particular instances, and yet, somehow, I cannot help but fear that the human condition remains as debased and simple as ever.”
Kurt: "I suppose one has to take into account the "Reach for the Stars" type attitude popularised by the American Dream. Let's face it, this is a world wide phenomenon now, where everyone is ingrained with the idea that one can do anything if it is desired enough. This is nonsense, of course, but people need to find that out for themselves."
Stuart: "And let us just leave aside any comment on the quality of those shows, as being completely irrelevant for what we are discussing here."
Lester: "But, by the same token, I feel that I need to watch Jerry Springer, as I need to keep in touch with what is going on, see what I am up against. And besides, its fun watching rednecks screw up their lives."
Kurt: "Cynical, non? I do believe we have an elitist lurking in our midst."
Claire: "But even if the American Dream is wishful, is it a bad thing for people to have aspirations? I cannot help but think that there should be an element of self-improvement evident in all people, however I do not agree that the only means of that improvement lies in intellectual pursuits."
Ethan: "What is the alternative then? Isn't it just narcissism to spend all one's time exercising, just to make sure one looks good? And although selflessness is perhaps a noble pursuit, and something to aspire to, I don't know that it is realistic, given our capitalist climate. In addition to which, I just don't believe that all people are capable of such a giving nature. Call me a cynic, I guess."
Charles: “Moral development doesn’t necessarily require intellectual sophistication.”
Kurt: “He speaks!”
Ethan: “Religion is simply the opiate of the masses.”
Kurt: “But you are just an arse"
Stuart: “But do we really want to go down the road of religion? We could really be getting into a debate on the value of religion, and the increasing secularisation of the modern world. The churches are in crisis, as they fail to appeal to a number of the youth of today, as well as answer many of the more liberal ideals that are becoming regarded as common place in society. Does this mean that as our moral code fails, there is an increasing threat of anarchy? Or is this simply an over-reaction to the problems of religion, as it is only those people who regard themselves as “educated” that show increasing disillusion with the Church, and in fact, amongst the masses, faith is as strong as ever?”
Claire: “Did any of you read that article on the NY Times about some of the places people are opting to go to on ‘date nights’? Little out of the way takeaways, the idea being to emphasise the informal, keep it cheap, but also be able to do something a little different.”
Ethan: “Now there is a non-sequiter if ever I have heard one…”
Kurt: “No, I didn’t see that. But then I can’t say that I browse the news for things like that…”
Claire: “Liar. By the way, I think E-News is on right now”
Lester: “I know, and did you see what she was wearing whilst she was walking her dog? I mean, honestly, darling if you have to pick up your dog’s crap, at least be stylish whilst you do it!”
Claire: “Har har”
Ethan: “Now, now, children. For all the soreness of the topic, I think there are many more closet romantics than most will ever admit. But, even I have to say that there was a line in the article where the interviewee “sighs” and says something about her being “too in love for own good”. I wanted to throw up.”
Stuart: “Does this mean that religion is no longer a question that people are interested in discussing?”
[silence]
Stuart: “Hmphff, I have my answer then.”
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